Peter Shankman is the Founder of HARO – Help A Reporter Out, which became the standard for thousands of journalists looking for sources. He also founded and leads The ShankMinds Breakthrough Network, which is an elite, online mastermind of thought leaders, business experts, and change-makers, as well as Faster than Normal – a podcast on ADHD, focusing on the superpowers and gifts of having a “faster-than-normal brain.”
The New York Times has called Peter Shankman “a rockstar who knows everything about social media and then some.” He is a 5x best-selling author, entrepreneur and corporate keynote speaker, focusing on customer service and the new and emerging customer economy. He is recognized worldwide for radically new ways of thinking about the customer experience, social media, PR, marketing, advertising, and ADHD.
In his personal life, Peter is a father, a 2x ironman triathlete, a class B licensed skydiver, and an avid Peloton rider. He’s based in NYC with his daughter and 19-year-old cat, both of whom refuse him access to the couch.
Transcript:
Bryan Wish:
Peter, welcome to the One Away Show.
Peter Shankman:
Good to be here. Thanks for having me.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah, absolutely. As I shared earlier, it was great hearing you talk a few years ago back at the NextGen. So thank you, Justin and Dylan. Peter, what is the one away moment that you want to share with us today?
Peter Shankman:
I think the one away moment for me was the day that I day after I sold Help A Reporter Out. For me, I worked really hard and in three years built this company, busted my to do it, and it was acquired and proved to me that something I built was worth something, was worth a lot actually by another company. And then wound up, when it got acquired, I thought it was amazing. And the announcement was made in Washington, DC. And I live in New York City. And the next day I flew back home, after the announcement was made.
Peter Shankman:
The announcement was made and I flew back home. I remember I got home and I was in the elevator and I had two cats at the time. I was in the elevator and I was coming into my apartment. And for the first time in my life, I started to believe my own press. For the first time in my life, I let myself believe that I might be as good as other people said. And I remember think getting in the elevator, I’m like, “Man, I’m the shit. I got some money. I just sell this company. I got a lot of money in the bank, I’m the bump.” And I walked in the apartment and I had two cats and both the cats over the 24 hours, I left them alone, had gotten into a 25 pound bag of dried food. And they basically eaten as much as they could and then drank as much water as they could, and then puked their guts up on my entry hallway rug.
Peter Shankman:
And they did this multiple times, six, seven times in a row, at least over the course of 24 hours. And so I walked in and I’m greeted by these two catches sort of smiling at me with just fucking rivers of puke on the rug. I spent the first three hours of my life as a millionaire scrubbing cap puke from my rug. And I really believe that was my life changing moment, not someone selling the company, but that moment as I’m on my knees, scrubbing out cat puke, because that was the universe saying to me, “Okay, you did good, but don’t get cocky. Stay humble because this can go away really, really fast.” And I don’t think enough people understand that, they do well, something blows up, they get big, something happens and they just assume it’s all going to be like that forever.
Peter Shankman:
And whether it’s fame or money or fortune or whatever, everything in this universe is so fleeting. And I don’t think anywhere near enough people understand how fleeting everything can be. Fame is great, money is great, powers… But can be all taken away from you so quickly. And that’s one of the things that people really need to understand is that if you have any level of success, two things have to happen. You have a responsibility to send the elevator back down and help other people. But you also have to understand that you are fortunate. You might have worked your ass off and I’m not denying that I did work my ass off. No question about it. But working your ass off is different, you have to continue working your ass off. The second you sit there and say, “Okay, I did it. I’m awesome.” That’s the second you start failing.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah. Wow.
Peter Shankman:
And it’s very important that people remember that, you have to keep working every day like you were just starting out.
Bryan Wish:
My mom told me always growing up, you only as good as your last step back.
Peter Shankman:
Yep. No question about it.
Bryan Wish:
And what a humbling experience to walk into the cat and the puke on the rug and after such a high. It’s like you were evened out in a way, amazing way.
Peter Shankman:
It was amazing. Here’s the thing, the cat’s name was karma. I totally believe that was supposed to happen. [crosstalk 00:04:28].
Bryan Wish:
Weird.
Peter Shankman:
How cool is that? The cat name was karma. I mean, that was supposed to happen, right?
Bryan Wish:
Oh, weird goosebumps. Wow. Okay. So you said something I want to lean into a little bit. You said you world [inaudible 00:04:45] elevator up, the first time as a millionaire and created something of immense value, but the way you described it in my sense was it was almost validating in a way, like you finally had that worth of achievement. So my question to you is prior to the acquisition of HARO, did you have that sense of validation or self worth, or was it maybe more fulfilled once the acquisition happened?
Peter Shankman:
Well, you got to realize that one of the things about me I’m massively ADHD. As a fact, one of my projects, I’ve written a best selling book called Faster Than Normal, which focuses on the gifts of ADHD. But the thing about ADHD is that ADHD magnifies your successes and your failures, and it also magnifies how your brain works. So it magnifies greatly all of your imposter syndrome, any level of imposter syndrome you might have is magnified a billion times when you have ADHD or any sort of neurodiverse brain. And so it has always been, and still very much is very hard for me to believe that I am doing anything beneficial, that I am succeeding in any way, that I am having fun, that I am generating revenue, that people actually like me.
Peter Shankman:
Not a day goes by, I get to the point where I wake up every morning and I’m sure that today is the day that New York Times is going to write an article about how completely full of shit I am. And then when I check the New York Times and they haven’t written it, the only reason they haven’t written it is obviously because I’m not important enough for the New York Times to want to cover me. So it’s a constant battle with your brain to try and convince your brain to just keep moving forward. As Rocky says, keep moving forward, that’s how winning is done. It’s not how hard you hit, how hard you get hit and how much you can take and keep moving forward. And so a lot of what I focus on that I’ve learned from these lessons is the concept that the only person I’m trying to beat is myself yesterday. And if I can do a little bit better today than I did yesterday, I’m doing okay.
Peter Shankman:
And I stopped caring years ago what other people think. And it’s not always as easy as it sounds. It’s not always as easy, “Oh, I don’t care what they think.” Of course, you do. You’re always going to care, but if you work at it, you care less and less. And I know that what matters to me is how I’m doing today versus yesterday. I did a 45 minute row… Today, I have a rowing machine behind me and I did a 45 minute row today. And I got my best time ever. I broke 10,000 meters in 45.
Bryan Wish:
Congrats.
Peter Shankman:
And that’s huge for me, especially because I’ve been training for the Ironman World Championships in Kona, Hawaii, and for two years in a row, they’ve been canceled because of COVID. So I’ve been training for this for 36 months and they keep getting canceled and I have foot issues and all this. So you find what you can do that keeps you moving forward. And it doesn’t have to be a lot, it can be a little tiny thing each day, but it has to be something. Because otherwise you’re just going to sit there and you start believing your own press. And then you’re either going to start believing your own press or you’re going to start believing your own brain. And both of those can be deadly.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah, absolutely. Well, what great awareness, obviously you’ve lived with ADHD for a number of years or since you were born and have found maybe the right ways to cope, or maybe not believe little in your own press in the brain, which can be a dangerous place when you aren’t focused on the 1% better mentality of every day. Just curious, when I saw you talk a few years ago and just even now, I think you have a more, let’s just say positive, warm into the energy to maybe your experiences. How was your ADHD maybe nurtured growing up by your family? Just curious how you’d answer that question.
Peter Shankman:
Well, when you’re ADHD… ADHD doesn’t exist when I was growing up. When I was growing up in the 70s and 80s, ADHD didn’t exist, what existed was, “Sit down, you’re disrupting the class again.” And Peter would be… I’ll read this to you. Literally on my Facebook profile, my background photo is something I found in my parent’s storage unit several years ago. Apparently they saved everything. And one of the things they saved was my second grade report card, where they listed socialization, “Peter accepts responsibilities and he’s very helpful in class. However, he shows little self control in speech. And at times doesn’t follow directions. He can work independently, but has a relatively short attention span for his age. Therefore he doesn’t concentrate on his work. Peter seems to relate with children either older or younger than himself.”
Peter Shankman:
So that right there that tells you everything you need to know about how they framed ADHD. ADHD was framed as you are disrupting the class, therefore, what you have is a negative and you are broken. And so I grew up with 25, 30 years of you are broken. And it wasn’t until I finally got diagnosed and looked at my ADHD as, “Holy shit, this could actually be a positive because all this weird that I’ve been getting in trouble for, that I do is actually beneficial and actually helps me if I use it the right way. And if I put rules into place.” So growing up, my parents were very supportive, they’re incredibly supportive of me. I’m very fortunate. And they’re still alive. They live three blocks from me in Manhattan, which is great, like instant built in babysitter for me; well, for my kid.
Peter Shankman:
But the downside is that they just figured that it was a fuck up. They just figured, “Okay. He walks to the beat of a different drama. He’s a little weird. Maybe he’ll survive. We’ll figure out a way.” But when I quit my last, I had one job in my life. I worked for America Online. And when I got laid off by them, I came back home and like, “Okay, let’s start my own company.” And I’m going to call it The Geek Factory. And we’re going to do PR, I’ve never done PR before, but how hard can it be? And my parents just sit there like… Yet year and a half later, or two years later, Geek Factory was acquired.
Peter Shankman:
So it’s one of those things that they started over time to realize, “Okay, what he’s doing is actually good. It works for him.” And that’s one of the key things that I think every entrepreneur has to learn what works for you is what matters. I’ve said this, God, I say this all the time and I keep saying, if you enjoy it or if it helps you and it benefits you and it doesn’t hurt anyone else, it doesn’t matter what anyone else thinks.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah. Wow.
Peter Shankman:
Right. And I think that people just need to learn that and understand that better because they don’t
Bryan Wish:
Totally. Yeah. It’s hard I think, to get pretty comfortable with yourself. I think first and foremost, to figure out what works for you in a world of comparison and especially entrepreneurs who are constantly, I think seeking validation, there’s a lot of them-
Peter Shankman:
They’re seeking validation and they’re also seeking advice. And that’s the biggest problem is that, listen to everyone, but be really aware of the advice that you take. There are some CEOs out there and entrepreneurs out there, “Hustle, hustle, hustle. And if you only have 24 hours a day and you have a family and you have a full-time job and you only can sleep four hours, sleep two hours and work those other two hours.” They’re telling you how to kill yourself. Be very aware and careful of whose advice you take.
Bryan Wish:
Totally.
Peter Shankman:
At the end of the day, I’m active in NFTs and I’m active in crypto and oh my God, there are 57 trillion people who will give you advice, “Oh, sell this one, buy this one.” Listen to everything but at the end of the day, make your own decisions based on the research that you’ve done.
Bryan Wish:
Mm-hmm (affirmative). No doubt. Totally. Yeah. It’s a, I think hard lessons to learn, to trust yourself. Nut to your point, you’ve not saying you’re perfect at it, but I think just how you’ve grown up and developed, you’ve had to learn to lean into that to the best.
Peter Shankman:
Also I embrace my fuckups. I mean, God knows, I have made so many mistakes in my life. The whole reason I have an assistant, I’ve had her for 13 years. And the whole reason happens because my first international speaking gig was I was hired to speak in Singapore. And I book my ticket two months in advance and I get to the airport. I’m like, “I’m so excited. This is awesome.” Flight was like, “Hey,” getting interested like, “Hey, where are you going?” “I’m going to Singapore.” And I hand in my passport, “You’re going to Singapore? I’m like, “Yeah, I’m going to Singapore.” “You booked the ticket to Shanghai.” And I didn’t even hear her. I’m like, “Yeah, going to Singapore.” She’s like, “And you booked a ticket to Shanghai.” I’m like, “Oh, are they close? Can I rent a car?” “No, they’re not close. They’re about 8,000 miles away. It’s over water, which would like me to price you a new ticket.” And I end up spending the entire fee that I made for that speech, plus like an extra 600 bucks or something to change that flight. Lesson learned.
Peter Shankman:
So as long as you’re learning from these things, mistakes, I’ll never hire anyone who hasn’t failed. You have to fail. It’s the greatest thing in the world. If you don’t fail, I don’t want to know you. If you haven’t failed, what’s the purpose. You need to fail, it’s so mandatory you have to fail. No, I’ve given you 400 treats, go away, go play somewhere else. But yeah, you have to fail. It’s a requirement because if you don’t fail, you can’t grow. And if you can’t grow, you can’t learn.
Bryan Wish:
Absolutely.
Peter Shankman:
You can’t learn, you can’t grow.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah. Absolutely. And I just appreciate the context. I want to come back to that moment with cats, but before I do just one question for you. You’ve talked about maybe some of the effort moments around ADHD and maybe some of the things, but you’ve seen it as an upside as well and you’ve seen it as a positive. For the listeners listening and can you maybe share maybe some of the more positive experience or more positive upsides of the things that you’ve discovered that are opportunities and advantages of actually having ADHD.
Peter Shankman:
So there are countless advantage, I can’t even… Where do I begin to start? As long as you know how your brain works and you understand how to do it, and you understand how to avoid the pitfalls. It’s a great movie that came out that you’re probably way too young to remember called WarGames. It starred Matthew Broderick and I think it was Ally Sheedy. And it was a kid who manages to hack his modem into the department of defense and almost start new nuclear war with Russia. And there is a restaurant below that I gladly could easily sell you to. Cut it out. And long story short is this great line where he has to teach the computer that nuclear war has no winners, everyone loses. And he does this with tic-tac-toe.
Peter Shankman:
And the last line of the movie is the robot learning or the computer learning and it says, “Interesting game, the only winning move is not to play.” And one of the things about that I learned about ADHD is that you have a very, very fast brain, which means that you’re moving in a million miles an hour. And if you have a Honda Accord, and you’ve driven that Honda Accord all your life, and then one day someone shows up with Lamborghini says, “Here, it’s for you,” trades you. And you start driving this Lamborghini. If you drive it the same way you drive a Honda Accord, floor it to get on the highway because it doesn’t go that fast. You’re going to crash on a tree, you’re going to die.
Peter Shankman:
And so I’ve had to learn how to use my faster brain by putting regulations and rules into place, to prevent me from driving into a tree or cleaning off the road. Having a faster brain is awesome. I wrote a bestselling book called Faster Than Normal. And actually the one before that too called Zombie Loyalists, both bestsellers. I wrote them entirely on planes. Literally Zombie Loyalists, I had a year to write the book and I did all the research the first month and forgot about it. And then the publisher calls me like two weeks left. She’s like, “Hey, ready?” I’m like, “Yeah, no problem.” I have nothing written, not one page. And I booked a flight the next day. I literally hung up the phone and called the United booked a flight to Tokyo leaving the next morning.
Peter Shankman:
And I brought my laptop and a sweatshirt and a power cord and my headphones. And I got on the plane and I wrote chapters one through five on the flight Tokyo, I landed into Tokyo, went to the lounge, 14 hours, had a cup of coffee and a piece of sushi, took a shower, got back on the same plane, same seat, two hours later, and wrote chapter six through 10 on the flight home. I didn’t even clear immigration. I landed 36 to 34 hours like that later with a book. And then got held up Homeland Security for five hours because I didn’t actually clear immigration in Tokyo. But literally I spent $5,000 and everyone was like, “Oh my God, you’re crazy. You spent $5,000 to go nowhere.” I’m like, “No, I spent $5,000 to write a book because I know how my brain works.”
Peter Shankman:
When I get on that plane, there is literally nothing I can do, but sit there and can be on my computer. Internet sucks, I’m not going to walk off the plane. There are no good movies, I’m going to write. I have no distractions. And so it’s about learning how my brain works. The reason that I’m able to have this conversation with you right now and not get distracted in a million different things, I’m looking out my window. I’m on the 56 floor. I have a gorgeous view of Manhattan, but the reason I’m focused on you right now is because I spent 45 minutes this morning working out. I did a really, really hard rower workout. And that gave me the dopamine and the serotonin and the adrenaline that I need to be able to focus on this conversation. So it’s about knowing yourself, your neurodiverse brain is capable of incredible things, as long as you know how to you use it properly.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah. Wow. That Tokyo story is unbelievable. I’ve never heard anything like it. So thanks for the story. But I think the overall theme of what you just said, it’s knowing how you work and then how do you build in the behaviors or behavior sets, for you to be most effective, like rowing in the morning. So I’m thrilled that… I feel like most people never reached that level of bodily or mental awareness. And the fact that-
Peter Shankman:
Well, I keep in mind, don’t put me on any sort of pedestal. I’m certainly not any better than anyone else, I just know what works for me. And I know it works for me primarily because I fucked up so many times. There’s a reason I very, very, rarely drink. In fact, I quit for several years and there’s reason I super rarely… I’ll have a drink maybe in a twice a year, if that, and it’ll be in a specific place. Like my girlfriend will come over and we’ll have a drink in my apartment to celebrate something. We won’t go out. We won’t go to a bar because I know I don’t… There’s a great line from the TV show West Wing, I don’t want one drink, I want 10 drinks.
Peter Shankman:
And I don’t think of myself as having a problem in the respect that I’m very aware of it. But if I took the governor’s off of how I live my life and accepted, “Oh yeah, come to this office party, come to this event, come to this holiday party.” I believe at any given day, I’m three bad decisions in a row away from being a junkie in the streets. And so the key is not to start that first decision. And so I’m very aware of the things I do. My keynotes anywhere in the world basically say, I’ll keynote, you’ll pay me and pay my travel. Except in Las Vegas, in Las Vegas, I’m required to do a lunchtime keynote and that’s it. And if you want me for a morning or an evening keynote, you’re going to fly me to LA either the night before or the day of my keynote. You’ll fly me in the night before to LA and then you’ll pay for a 6:00 AM flight to fly me from LA to Vegas to give a morning keynote at 9:00 AM.
Peter Shankman:
Because otherwise I have to fly into Vegas the night before and spend the night in Vegas, nothing good’s going to come of that. Am I going to gamble away my daughter’s college fund, of course not, but let’s not give myself the opportunity to test that theory.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah.
Peter Shankman:
So you learn what works for you and you learn what doesn’t. If I don’t exercise every day, it is a very, very slippery slope to skipping one day, turning into skipping four weeks. And then I skip four weeks and now I weigh 20 pounds more. I’m miserable. I hate everyone, fuck this life. So you literally have to understand how your body works and how your brain works and work with it in that capacity. Because if you don’t, bad things can happen. It’s great to be an entrepreneur, great to have this level of speed on the flip side, you got to know how to control it.
Bryan Wish:
I appreciate the awareness. I appreciate the context to your own life and your own behaviors. And one more question, I’m going to get back to the one away moment. What would you say to the… I remember at your talk, a few years ago, you offered people to go run with you. So let’s say that running group that you cultivated, what would you say to those people for how to develop that level of awareness for their own body? What does that take?
Peter Shankman:
It takes a lot of mistakes. No one really… You never meet anyone, I very rarely meet anyone who has a laundry list of things they’ve of lessons they’ve learned when good stuff happens. I mean, I learned some good… Shut up. I learned some good stuff when I sold the company. But I’ve learned so much more by the mistakes I’ve made because… I heard a great quote once. Remember that time you confused the soulmate with a life lesson. Dude, no joke, I learned more about myself and about what I need in my life from former relationships. And I’m in a relationship right now with someone and I am just so fucking lucky to have gone through everything I went through because it prepared me to be who I am to meet her and to be ready when she came into my life.
Peter Shankman:
So you have to understand that and you have to know that the mistakes, again, the mistakes are the best things you could possibly want. And that’s how you learn. And that’s how you grow is if you don’t look at… I mean, mistakes suck. I’m not like, “Oh yeah, I made a mistake.” I’m not like that, but the key is find that value you in everything that goes wrong. There’s value in it somewhere, find out what it is and that’ll change you. That’ll help you tremendously.
Bryan Wish:
Wow. Quote is good. I appreciate the transparency and the perspective. And I appreciate just you sharing you’re learning from mistakes, but having the awareness to make changes around them. So really, really good to talk about just health, mental health, body health, all the things that I think allow someone to operate and succeed in the most profound ways. So let’s go back after we’ve addressed the past a bit in a beautiful way, by the way, about you selling the business, walking up to your rug and what happened after? You became levelheaded in an instant and then all of a sudden you’re a millionaire at the same time. So who did Peter become after those two moments?
Peter Shankman:
I don’t know if I’ve changed that much. I think that at the core, I’m still this dork who likes to try new things. I think I have been given the benefit of, again, not caring so much what other people think, selling a company will do that. But on the flip side, I like to think I’ve become much more aware of not only who I am, but what I can accomplish. And when I think back… A friend of mine is a former Navy SEAL. He’s retired now. And he always talks about Hell Week, Hell Week is this thing that in week five of Navy SEAL training, they basically put the candidates through like a full week where they get, I think they get five hours sleep in 168 hours. And the rest of it is just hardcore training.
Peter Shankman:
And they’re running and they’re running like hundreds of miles in that week. And they’re doing exercises and they’re this and that. And about half the class rings out, they ring a bell and they’re immediately, they leave the program and they’re transferred back to wherever they were, the Marines, Air Force, Army, whatever. And there’s always a handful that finish and they go on and the master chiefs, the guy who’s in charge of everything said, I remember he told me that he said this… He’s one of the guys who survived and he got through Hell Week and he talked about how he felt afterwards. And he said something that, I mean, makes me tear up to this day. He said… You’re relieved, you survived Hell Week, go rest now. And he said, “But guys, one thing, remember this, no matter what you do for the rest of your life, whether you stay in the military for your entire career, or whether you do your term and you go out and you open a latte stand.”
Peter Shankman:
He goes, “It doesn’t matter. Remember this, you survived this. And you can survive anything. If you survive this, you can survive anything.” And I always think about that because through the good and the bad I’m still here. Another great quote, remember that girl, you said you could never live without, when she broke up with you years ago, look at you all living and shit. It’s this concept that we are so much stronger than we think we are. Seriously, dog, come on. We were so much stronger than we think we are. And we just have to understand that yeah, bad stuff is going to come and test us every single day and how we work it, how we get through it, determines whether or not we’ll survive it.
Peter Shankman:
And I look at all the mistakes I’ve made and all the stupid things I’ve done and see how they benefited me and see how I’ve done well from them and what’s next in that regard. And what can I do that has helped me? And what can I do that is… What have I learned from this? And taking that with me. But in the end, I’m still just the guy who… As my mother put it, she tells a story and fondly of when she walked into my room and I was like eight years old, and I had somehow trapped, they had a family cat. I had somehow trapped the cat in my room and was about to shave it. And my mother said to me, she goes, “Okay, number one, stop that. You’re not going to shave this cat. Number two, why would you do that?” And I looked, I said, “I wanted to see what would happen.” And she goes, “Nothing good happens if you shave a cat.” This is terrible conversation.
Peter Shankman:
But in my head, that’s exactly how my brain worked. Let’s see what happens. Every company I’ve started, everything I’ve done. I had an idea on a plane back from Iceland the other day. I’m like, “I wonder if you do a webinar on da, da, da.” And so on the plane, I wrote like a four paragraph thing and said, “Okay, I’m going to launch this webinar. I’m going to charge 50 bucks for it or whatever. And I post it online.” I’m like, “Anyone want to come to this?” And like 100 people have signed up so far. So 100 people, times 50 bucks a person. Because why wouldn’t you? What do you have to lose? And I think that’s the most important thing.
Peter Shankman:
So many ideas have died not because they’ve been bad. I mean, a lot of ideas have died because they’re bad, but not because they’ve been bad. More ideas have died more than anything else, more ideas have died because people didn’t go after them. And they just stayed there on the side of the road as other ideas pass them by. And the only difference between your idea and their idea was that they had a little more determination to go and do it.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah. There’s that quote about the graveyard and all the ideas that never were born and they’re in the graveyard because people never acted on them. And that just mantra of let’s see what happens to go build or build a life that you want is great. And maybe under that same vein, since the acquisition, how have you maybe taken that quote, let’s see what happens and applied it to new ideas, new ventures, books, talks; what has maybe been the result of going in with that open mind?
Peter Shankman:
I think for me, what I’ve learned from that is you never know what’s going to succeed, but you definitely know what’s going to fail if you don’t take the opportunity. If you don’t take the opportunity, you’re definitely going to fail. There’s no question about it. And that is pretty much the only guarantee in life is that if you don’t try, you’re going to fail. So why not try? And I don’t know if I can explain that any better or any easier that is literally it.
Bryan Wish:
Totally.
Peter Shankman:
If you don’t try, you’re going to fail. So try, what’s the worst going to happen? You do fail, but at least you tried.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah, absolutely. I think it’s so important to go after the things that you believe in. And I think you test-
Peter Shankman:
What other chance do you have? Literally what other options are there? That’s it.
Bryan Wish:
And Peter, just because we’re kind of going here on this early morning, I’m West Coast, but we’re going here on the Monday. If you were to write a memoir, it was going to be your last book, what are maybe some of the top moments that you would include that maybe you’re most proud of or have been fulfilled by from your own life?
Peter Shankman:
I think definitely having my daughter, obviously; that goes without saying. Again, selling my company, buying my first apartment because living in New York City, that’s not necessarily an easy thing to do. I think, more than any of that, except my daughter’s [inaudible 00:31:20] is number one. But next right next to that is writing a book that every day to this day, five years later, I get emails from people thanking me. And that’s Faster Than Normal, that’s about ADHD. Emails from people telling me that the first time they don’t feel like they’re alone, for the first time they see someone else that has the same issues that they do and every single day. I’ve written five books. Four of them are business books. This fifth one was not and that’s the one that I have the most love for and get the most responses for. So that to me is everything.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah, it’s amazing what happens when you’re personal or vulnerable and how it can create their connective tissue to help others realize they’re not alone and giving them maybe a source of hope. I was talking to a woman last week, and she said to me, people who are close to suicide or people who take their life, she said, the reason is not only because they’re in just such pain, but because they don’t have hope. And I thought that was very chilling, bu to what you said, giving others hope in similar shoes through your own personal journey is a very powerful thing to do. So neat how you’ve taken your own pain and experiences, and also opportunities that have come from it to help others through the same.
Peter Shankman:
Thank you. Yeah. Look again, despite the fact that it appears that every single person in this world, at least in this country right now hates every single other person in this country, we still haven’t figured out anywhere else to go.
Bryan Wish:
Right.
Peter Shankman:
So I feel like our options are limited there, so why not try and help people?
Bryan Wish:
Or you take Elon’s spaceships [crosstalk 00:33:00].
Peter Shankman:
Whether or not Elon should be a [inaudible 00:33:02] for anything is up for debate, but let’s not go there.
Bryan Wish:
Sure. Let’s do one more question. And this has been a lot of fun and really meaningful and enjoyable. Saying that your daughter has been the most fulfilling all your life. What has being a father taught you about living and how does that apply to your business and maybe even your personal relationships?
Peter Shankman:
Great question. It’s taught me several things. It’s taught me number one, that you can make a grilled cheese, countless ways wrong. I had no idea about this. I thought you put bread, little butter, cheese, toast it, no. Turns out you can make grilled cheese about 66 different ways, all of which are incorrect. What else have I learned? I’ve learned that you can never rest on your laurels when you have a kid, and it’s a great metaphor for life. A kid is going to constantly test you and constantly find new ways to even no matter what you said yesterday is going to alter that somehow, and everything’s going to change and you have to be constantly on your toes to get that answer. And so that’s one of the best things I’ve ever found, because that’s the same thing for work and same thing for business, same thing for life. You should constantly be learning constantly, be trying to do new things.
Peter Shankman:
I think also one of the cool things I learned that came from having a daughter is really making an extended effort every single day to be the person that my daughter wants me to be. And I think that, again, it’s something that you can learn in real time for the world. So many people try to be the person that… I saw a great commercial once. It showed a guy, it was for a dog adoption company or dog rescue service. And it showed a cop pulling over a speeder and the cop comes over and says, “I need your license.” And he takes it, “That’s such a cool license. Man, I’m so lucky to be stopping you. You’re just the coolest. God, you’re incredible. Here’s your license back. I don’t deserve it. Just drive safe.” And the guy’s like, “My God.” And pans over to the passenger seat, there’s a dog there and the dog’s just looking at the guy and the captain is like, “Be the person already thinks you are.”
Peter Shankman:
And it’s the same with my daughter, my daughter will know, I’m daddy, I’m awesome but I got to live up to that. I’m good friends with her mom. We’re divorced, but I’m good friends with her mom. And I will always treat her mom with the utmost level of respect and kindness because I never want my daughter to accept any less from that when she goes out with the real world. So you got to focus on that. I’ll show up at her school and pick her up on a random Tuesday with flowers, just because it’s random Tuesday. And I want her to expect that, I want her to under… But just the same. I want her to get hurt. I want her to become stronger and be that warrior princess that… Not just a princess, not just a warrior, but the warrior princess that I know that she can be.
Peter Shankman:
So having a kid is great because it helps you grow and it helps you realize that A, it’s not all about you, in fact it never was. And B, there’s always room to grow and always room to improve.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah. Wow. That’s great. That’s great you don’t put her in the middle with the mom. That’s-
Peter Shankman:
We’re all good.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah. That’s great. Have you seen David Foster Wallace speech, This is Water.
Peter Shankman:
Yeah.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah. I resonated a lot with that, but to what you said, we’re not the center of the universe. There’s a lot of things going on around us that we got to be conscious to. And you all always living with got to be better every day, being a dad’s a full-time job and again, it’s never ending. So Peter, thank you for one, your wisdom today, your stories, your humor, your depth. This is super enjoyable. Where can people find you by your book, reach out to you, all the things?
Peter Shankman:
So I’m @petershankman on every single one of the socials. My website is shankman.com. My email is petershankman.com and anyone is welcome to reach out. I’m always happy to talk to you. I also have my own crypto coin. It’s on the Rally platform and it’s just SHANK. So I’m pretty findable, it’s kind of hard not to find me. So you have to really work hard to not find me on the online.
Bryan Wish:
Yeah, absolutely. Well, best of luck to you and your dog as well, and daughter. And talk to you soon.
Peter Shankman:
All right. Looking forward to it.